Watch New Fighting Game Players Learn Without Fixating on Difficulty Challenge (IMPOSSIBLE) - lightslingergame.com

Watch New Fighting Game Players Learn Without Fixating on Difficulty Challenge (IMPOSSIBLE)

Sajam
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No don’t be impressed by how quickly novices pick up on strategies that work, instead let’s focus on how one person was salty so clearly they’re right and it’s the fighting games fault.

streamed Apr. 18, 2022

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35 Comments

  1. the true need to be told. fighting games are for alpha males/fps is for beta males.

  2. The forehead line definitely refers to playing Eddie, smashing buttons and have him spin all over the place. I absolutely remember doing that when I was like 8-9 years old 😀 If I never got into fighting games after that, I’d definitely feel what he’s saying.

  3. Sajam is so wrong here that he seems out of touch. It is untenable to argue that fighting games are as easy to get into as a shooting game. Even if you're getting your ass kicked in TF2 after just installing it 3 minutes ago, you can still shoot your gun, you can still reload, you can still move around the map and look around. In a fighting game, all of your actions are locked behind a learning curve that takes time to overcome.

    People who are just being introduced to fighting games aren't going to understand , for instance, what a quarter circle is, how to do it, and why their fireball is locked behind a stick motion to begin with. This becomes even more complicated when you add in charge motions, semi-circles, 360s, and whatever shit you Tekken players are doing. Now don't get me wrong, I love me some motion inputs. It's satisfying for me to charge up my Urien tackle during my block, and then charge in after the pushback. It is fun to use motion inputs, but new players are always going to struggle to get through this step, as the game is almost unplayable if you don't know how to do motions, unless your fighting someone who also doesn't know how to do motions.

    An action as simple as blocking is going to come off as really complicated to someone who's just picking up the game. "You have to hold back, but only when you're about to get hit otherwise you start moving backwards and sometimes you have to press down and back but other times you have to press middle and back but if you press up and back your character jumps backwards." You take this for granted because you've played fighting games for a long time, but people starting out in fighting games struggle at these simple steps. And if a player can't figure out how to block, or throw a fireball, they're simply locked out of a large portion of the game's content – the game they probably spend $60 on.

    What really bothers me about your argument is that you seem to dismiss people who are trying to learn the game as "Going about it the wrong way", opting instead to point at people who are finding a funny move to spam and telling people that that's how you should go about starting in a fighting game. Nevermind the fact that E. Honda slapping repeatedly isn't going to do anything against the kinds of players you'll find who are still playing Street Fighter V, but telling people who bought a fighting game to not engage in the systems and mechanics that the game was built around, even going as far as to call out people who do, is incredibly dense of you.

    If you ever wonder why matchmaking sucks on so many fighting games, or why it takes so long to get into a match it isn't just because the netcode sucks, it's because there are less and less people who are playing these games who you can be matched up with. A friend of mine in Australia once told me that on average, there are only 3 other people that he gets matched up with in DBFZ. You need to populate these games with new players, and that simply isn't going to happen if you can't get people past the skill gap required to even feel comfortable playing the game online. Shooters don't have this issue, because that skill gap is nonexistent.

    People of all skill levels are still playing TF2, because there is no skill requirement to play that game with any sense of consideration. You have gun, you click on person, and if you click on them enough they die. In a fighting game, punching a person requires getting close to them, which requires a good sense of the games movement. To block requires a sense of highs and lows. To do a cool super usually requires you to stack two motion inputs on top of each other before hitting a button.

    If you want players to learn how to do these things, then you're going to have to understand the difficulty of overcoming these obstacles, while having to fight people online who have already overcome them. Getting to a level of fighting game play where you can actually start winning matches online is like banging your head against a wall and hoping the wall breaks first. It doesn't help anyone that when you here the new player complain that their head hurts, you tell them to just have fun hitting the wall.

    TL;DR Fighting games are inarguably harder to get into than shooters, and acting like it isn't leads to less and less people playing fighting games.

  4. I watched Brian F's video on this and now yours. What everyone fails to mention is that when you're getting beat in a fighting game you don't get to play. If you don't get to play when you're getting beat then you can't learn and the whole game appears futile. It doesn't matter what buttons you press while your character is getting thrashed, you don't get to play. In a shooting game you can still play while taking damage.

  5. The difference is Time To Fun. Ten hours vs. 100.

  6. She didn't figured that E honda move by her own. She read it from Twitter from that Twitter guy (forgot his name he vlogs too)

  7. the problem is that most gamers assume gaming started on a mouse and keyboard when no we started in arcades fps games aren't everything they get boring faster than fighting games

  8. There is nothing more satisfying than learning a fighting game and being decent at it…. Winning matches is too addicting.

  9. I get pissed when I get wrecked in a matchup I shouldn't lose especially when I have momentum but I always seem to mess it up that's infuriating but that's my fault not the fault of the game like come on dude lol

  10. Speaking as a newcomer to fighting games. I think the real issue for beginners is that not all fighting games are very good at teaching you how to play the game. You know some games just stuff a command list in your face and the most basic ass tutorial and then say go.

  11. I think this criticism is actually MORE valid for modern non-fighting games. 20 years ago you really did have to read the whole damn manual and practice offline to get competitive at SF or MK while you could drop into a Quakeworld lobby and it was just obvious what you were supposed to do. If you handed someone TF2 today and and told them to play it, wtf would they do? It never tells you why your teammates will randomly change color and shape and insta-kill you with a knife, or why everyone else is hitting buildings with wrenches.

    How does anyone play League or DoTA, for that matter? There are so many systems to memorize and so many characters and roles to understand. Fighting games follow a relatively reliable, set pattern of systems and controls compared to that.

  12. Honestly I think a lot of people dump on newer players for being bad because they themselves are bad (or at least they are insecure about their skill range) and just want any sort of feeling of superiority they can get lol. I'm usually not one for these sorts of pessimistic opinions but I kinda do feel that way lmao.

  13. Anytime I see people lose to the Honda mash I always tell them the same thing. Hold down back, wait for it to whiff, sweep, repeat. No fancy combos, no weird meter mechanics with v reversal, just sweep. Honda players who use this strategy will crash and burn the moment it stops working.

  14. I've been playing fighting games for 18 years and I still freak out when I discover some new random bullshit on a new character or using a new mechanic.

    If you can't find a part of yourself who knows exactly how it feels to repeat hundred hands on Honda, you've lost something precious and don't even know it.

  15. Cheap strategies are great. Because you feel even more like a BOSS once you figure out how to beat that shit. I've played Blazblue against a friend of mine. I main Koko, he chose Jin. Why did he choose him? Cause he has long-range, spammable normals. He tried to fight me fairly for the most part, but once he started losing he would spam those. I lost hard most times. Then that evening I decided to spend some time labbing some moves to beat his normal-spam strategy. I've found a VERY simple solution. A low that outranged him. Best time of my (gaming) life 🙂

  16. "Can we go back to the 90s… with my forehead?" BrolyLegs: Hold my pad.

  17. His rant about 1999. That was long before netplay, so unless you are going to tournaments, which was rare then too, you were playing your buddies. So yeah, a competitive game seems easier when your competition is just as inexperienced as you. Fighting games feel hard when your opponent is way better than you, because it is hard to beat someone way better. And it's easy to feel oppressed when your opponent is even slightly better than you.
    Basically, button mashing never worked, your opponents in 1999 just didn't know how to stop it.

  18. Bro is crying his heart out because of how bad he is at fighting games.

    Skill issue.

  19. Fighting games are like real combat sports where people who don’t do them imagine they will be naturally good at it for some weird reason. The people who get good are the ones who get over their ego after they get smacked around.

  20. omg you talked so much useless shit for 3 20 second videos that you actually make them boring, thanks alot

  21. You are not seriously comparing a first person shooter and the ability to aim to hitting a button with microsecond precision lmfao. Sf5's frame data is grossly particular. Ive been playing fighterz and guilty gear for some time now and holy shit is this game impossible in comparison. I agree with everything dude said. Hes spot on.

  22. I love SF been playing since Super Nintendo off and on stopped then got into it a bit again for 4 and 5 but I was mostly a button masher I’m now trying to learn the right way to play and man is it so frustrating but I want so bad to be good I have a friend that’s super nasty with every character meanwhile I’m trying to master one person out of the many characters I want to give up sometimes but my friend tells me it takes time he has been playing for like 15 plus years now I as well have played off n on for 15 or more years but unlike him I was a dumb masher now I’m paying for not learning biggest mistake ever I might suck but I’ll keep trying even if I only mast cammy juri n the upcoming Kimberly I will find away to get better

  23. WTF is that wall scroll in the background ma dood, ¿qcf aaaaa qcf?

  24. "all ken players are bitches" im entirely brand new to SF and playing 6 open beta was the first time I've really tried to play a fighting game and I will immediately agree. every ken I faced was a bitch, you could just tell. they have a very specific playstyle even as new players.

  25. Ive never seen a good player struggle in fighting games. They automatically high level but tell low level jus practice things nobody but me can do then u will improve and u wonder y the playerbase drops off the map

  26. No fighting game player is undefeated everyone can be beat at an fighting game always room and time for improving never doubt yourself if u lose keep playing

  27. Watching this in the era of sf6 is even more hilarious. They need to do this again with modern controls

  28. If I had one wish that could only be for something stupid, it would be to become famous enough not playing fighting games to get invited to one of these, then show up with my DIY hitbox and BM the fuck out of every match as I pranced my way to 1st.

  29. All games are the same pick ur poison

  30. The Honda clip is not fun, it's fucking miserable. Why do fighting games include such degenerate moves in them? In SF6, Honda is nothing close to top-tier (and in fact didn't even show up in the top 64 of evo 2023!!!!), but is such a disgusting scrub killer that even Punk lost in an earlier tournament to a Honda spammer. Maybe remove degenerate moves and improve his overall kit, and that way both newbies win (because they don't face moves that require 0 brain power to execute but are 100x harder to counter) and pros win (because the character is viable at the top-level).

  31. Reminds me of watching Gigguk try Guilty gear

  32. Nobody can relate to begging their friend who wants to get into fighting games to just learn how to anti air and experiment with the use of their normals instead of spending their first 40 hours grinding their “optimal bnb” with a character they’re going to drop after they lose a few matches

  33. I come from the future, being a fighting game player does make you the greatest gamer

  34. wait, wait, wait. 1 year ago when new players spam with Honda it's godlike and honorable and a tournament winning mindset, but now when players spam with Honda in 2023 it's game-ruining, and needs a rework, and unfair to new players? Nah, nah nah. Chanko brain forever. No headbutts = no life. Bath time. Throw the salt across the dohyo. Dosukoi!

  35. as a fan of apex and fighting games, its funny seeing people freak out over noko given how godlike he is at apex mnk, not even a controller player

  36. while I agree, I also disagree. Shooting games are ALOT easier to get into, and the proof is in the pudding with the number of players. While I agree that if you don't like fighting games you should just not play then instead of whining, I also think the FGC could make it easier to get into it.

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