A.B.I.torial: Did These Characters "Ruin" Fighting Games? - lightslingergame.com

A.B.I.torial: Did These Characters “Ruin” Fighting Games?

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34 Comments

  1. You can have a bear, a kangaroo, a nerd, a succubus, a robot kid, a dog, a cactus, a skeleton, a demon, a fking CAR and Pepsiman as fighters, but don't you dare put a kawaii anime girl, cuz that doesn't belong in a fighting game for some reason.

  2. No Patroklos? That guy (and the director of that game) pretty much butchered Soul Calibur

  3. Honestly I'm one of the few who wants Ingrid on SF6. Not because I like the character but rather they can use SF6 to improve on the character. Give her a more fleshed out backstory, give her flaws and a better personality.

  4. it's simple. Misogyny and Fragile Masculinity. Men can't stan women winning and beating up men and it's MORE frustrating to them when the said women are cutesy, hyperfeminine girls. They'd 'tolerate' it if it was a butch femme, tomboyish or a cold, assassin but they draw the line at hyperfemininity.

  5. Usually people claiming that a character has "no personality" mean that they have "no personality I find cool/sexy/interesting". I love fighting games but they really embody the saying "wide as an ocean, deep as a puddle" when it comes to their character lore.

  6. Coming back to this vid to answer yet again. Sorry that this is long winded I’m a massive yapper.

    Each character had individual problems of their release given coming in at the worst times to be received. Chloe “replacing eddy” for two years, Marie Rose being introduced as an original character for the dlc roster of doa5 expansion and Ingrid being introduced in port after port in a game where she’s just a bonus character.

    To top it off they’re all girl character with personalities that range from pure annoying excessive cuteness to smug/condescending rage bait. Then finally in Marie and Chloe’s case, their in game kits are incredible predictable/simple to tackle yet frustratingly annoying to go up against given their gimmicks and the pressure that comes with them. I mean Marie no matter how good I think her original 5 personality, design and moveset is was most definitely made to inflict rage on an opponent by losing to a character that both makes you feel stupid AND outright basically tells you that you are in her dialogue.

    She’s condescending, cocky, prideful and coldly bitchy to her opponent having a sense of superiority in her despite being so small. Her fighting style feels both unsettling deadly for a girl like her yet also has a ton of elegant and dainty moves to make it feel like she’s merely dancing around you, plus in game it’s a defensive hold specialist style hell bent on influencing your decision making and outright denying any advancement against her. She make YOU feel predictable whilst she herself being quite overly simple to beat herself.

    Chloe is very similar in her obliviousness to her obnoxious personality and a moveset that’s prettty trash in all things considered but like Marie gets INSANE DAMAGE value and enough trickery gimmicks to fuck with your head.

    This is also not considering how awfully Marie has been utilised since then as the new face of the doa series yet her personality turning a full 180 to be more cookie cutter to a non fighting game audience yet in turn ruining what made her so likeable. Her ability to be hated cause of how unfriendly and unappealing her rotten bratty personality was is what balanced out her cute design and complimented her overall design elements in other areas.

    Chloe herself not being given any meaningful story to give even the slightest explanation to her character besides a deeper more interesting personality yet that personality is never shown in game through intros or victory screens itself.

    Then despite all the things Marie does to give justification as to why little girl can fight back in fighting game with her SPECIFIC fighting style being systema and her actively wearing foot wear to make up for her short height in game to give realism people still just apparently can’t see it is plausible that a girl who’s only a few inches shorter than the MAIN PROTAGONIST of the series is can know a martial art that can allow her to fight back. Clearly being 4’10 and skinny and a girl must mean you are completely helpless to any and all forms of combat even in a VIDEO GAME UNIVERSE with ninja girls.

    Chloe is the same in this regard. Somehow cute girls fighting is for some reason not plausible or immersion breaking but not fantasy elements. My guess is it’s not unreasonable for the universe they’re in or even their game series but those specific haters perceptions on women/girls. She can’t fight cause she’s too small/fragile in my mind to ever fight back against someone like me or a “man”. Ignoring the fact that the game itself took the height and size into consideration and gave fighting styles and design choices to put more realism and justification for their ability to fight back even when they didn’t need to to just have a cute girl in a fighting game.

    They’re annoying both personality and combat wise plus they’re unapologetically feminine petite girls. In the eyes of those “serious gamers” they just don’t hold any traits that make them feel like a fighter, though granted the whole intended point is that neither of them were designed to be instantly recognisable as one.

    Marie is actively a character deceiving player perception and in story characters that her surface appearance is all there is when in actuality she’s so much deadlier or more than meets the eye. I mean her character was built to be both different yet a mystery wrapped in an obviousness that she is a mystery and that there is something more to her in every aspect of her character. Well Chloe really is just a pop idol who’s doing dance moves and tricking to fight and that’s okay cause characters have been able to fight with less and frankly she creates expansion to the world imo. Plus she’s just a bold design to have in the series.

    I just think characters like these were always gonna have dude bros hate on their existence but also a massive popularity and cult following for being characters that allow people who don’t see themselves as traditional fighters or strong to use that as an inherent strength in game, like small height or unthreatening looks to deceive and manipulate their opponent. They give incredibly fem people a character to gush over and feel represented by and add a unique design/addition to the cast to give more variety. In fairness I think they’ve gotten more hate than they have due to how mishandled they were by their creators rather than anything based on their designs, kits or concepts. They have little to know development or story and for Marie/Honoka’s case they’ve become faces without really the work out in to representing what the series is about.

    Had any of these character been introduced in a setting that allowed for further character exploration and smooth entrance into the series through being a main cast playable new addition with proper ground to settle and stand on then maybe we wouldn’t being having this conversation. In particular I think the mishandling of these characters, with Chloe being basically replaced now and Marie having so much of her og concept in 5 be scrubbed away to be more consumer friendly to Japan more culture for when she’s in spin offs I feel only gave ammunition to those who already hated them to say “we were right she is bad” simply because the companies behind them are doing not so great things with these characters if anything at all.

  7. I had that port, and Ingrid was legit, one of my favorite characters, I very much liked her style xD. But I suppose she might be a little TOO mystical for Street Fighter, for some at least.

  8. Those 4 characters are my type of character lol

  9. Those 4 characters are my type of character lol

  10. Ingrid shared too many similarities with SNK's Athena.

  11. I'd only have an issue if they were annoying.

  12. Marie Rose was the reason i even got into DoA at all. She was a stand out depature to what i thought of as just the boobs foghter game. I even took up learning how to render 3d art work because i staryed to truly like the characters and the game. Playing as MR in a dynasty warriors style game was also a wild dream come true and i wish more fighting games would make dw clones

  13. How someone can say "don't belong to this game" …..isn't most of fighting game players want a HUGE roster with all kinds of stuff, so for me to cut off characters rather than add them feels strange, people should care about BALANCING game … not about how one girl character steals spotlight from other girl character.

  14. I personally dont like the cute little girl type fighter in fighting games especially in anime fighters.

  15. DOA player here: I think it’s really funny that people hate Marie and Honoka for being children in a fighting game tournament, as if Kasumi and Ayane were not minors for the majority of the series.

  16. I actually like Ingrid. If they just fix her then then she will be liked

  17. I didn't like Ingrid the first time I played alpha 3 because she was hard to fight against and I got pummeled as 5 different characters but now….. She's alright to me

  18. Sakura is an exception that proves the rule. Sakura, even though she's a school girl has multiple aspects of her design and character that are explicitly made to ensure the player of why she would be participating in a fight. Sakura's animations and specific details in how she fights, show that she's inexperienced and still learning even though she's gifted and that has it make alot more sense then her effortlessly fighting like everyone else. People are always gonna find that far more endearing then someone like Ingrid or Lucky Chloe who are treated as equals to other fighters even when its at the expense of other characters.

  19. I think in general people just dislike when characters who look like they never been in a fight in their lives not only get put into fighting games but are also shown as equal if not stronger then mainstay characters who've had to both work hard to be where they are at and also look the part. You're whole argument that anyone can be in a fighting game is honestly just absurd. I don't think it takes much explanation on why 6'1 300lbs Honda seems like he could participate in a fight rather then a character designed to look like an underage girl. This isn't about "realism" this is about how all games have their own tone and what is reasonable in their world. I really hate disingenuous arguments like "its a video game you can do whatever you want" when any reasonable person knows that all fiction still has to follow its own rules.

  20. >Why don't people want pedo bait in their fighting gamesGee its a mystery

  21. Uninspiring intrusions lead by obedient appeasers of political agendas.

  22. I hate Lucky chloe, because her 'rivalry' with Eddie draws parallels between her crappy line dancing and Capoeira. One is crap and he other one is a martial art with rich history and cultural aspects – can you guess which one is which?

  23. I don't get it. Why does Lucky Chloe supposedly don't fit while no one complains about fucking Kuma or Gon? lol To me it sounds more as gatekeeping with people being afraid of the fighting game franchises appealing to broader audiences than anything else.

    Also I LOVE Ingrid's design I really wish Capcom would expand more on her as a character. And Marie Rose is absolutely awesome. I love how she uses the opponent's body against himself.

    Lastly, Capoeira DOES work on fights BUT it's very different from Eddy's in-game style. Capoeira when used to actually fight does not incorporate the more dance-like moves used for performances and (back in the day) disguise it as a dance. Instead it focuses on powerful kicks using your momentum and it can be absolutely devastating in a fight.

  24. I think they were hated because nobody knew them or could afford them i had to wait for Christmas or my birthday to get the Dlc. Some people just couldn't afford them so they don't know their movesets.

  25. Sexism. It’s sexism. As a woman who likes fighting games it’s 9 times out of 10 sexism.

  26. I hear people online say Ingrid is a mary sue but I don't see it. A lot of characters from fighting games are over powered but no one complains about them. Guess I just find it weird.

  27. 13:39 "capoeira wouldn't work in a fight" my dude doesn't know shit about brasilian history.

  28. Lucky Chloe is hated because if her personality and her "annoying move set" which I think is funny when they're the point of her character

  29. 2 years later, yeah that Sakura thing has a point

  30. Since I used to be a DOA fan and some people don't seem to reflect on what lead to the controversy surrounding Marie Rose and Honoka, I'll explain, at least what I think it's the reason, why the two were and are still hated:

    The issue is not their existence. The hate is because they literally overshadowed all the characters that defined the series before these two debuted. The fact that they kept on being shoved down at anyone's throat when they barely did anything to the series to deserve the popularity other than being loved to death by the japanese audience. Most people feel like their popularity is unwarranted and biased since they aren't even main-character material and feel they are completely forced into the franchise for the only reason being that they are little girls. They feel like the amount of work and animation was done so much into these two than anyone else due to the current producer being heavily biased with the cutesy "loli" thing, that fans feel like every other character is completely abandoned in favor of these two. That's why Marie Rose and Honoka are so hated. Because the only reason why they are popular is due to the japanese audience's (and the producer's) obsession over short girls and not because they are so cool that they deserve to be loved. Because it pretty much confirms that Koei Tecmo has officially gave up on making DOA a respectful fighting game series that we can enjoy and just embrace the fact that it's only unconditionally loved in Japan and that's it. And the remaining western fans of the series are pissed off on this and so they blame it all on the creation of Marie Rose and Honoka because those two symbolize the company abandoning the western fans as well as pretty much ALL the characters, including the OG female ones, in favor of the current japanese otaku audience that keeps making them money with Marie and Honoka.

    If they were at least put in the series just as fine additions and not necessarly being shoved down at everyone's throat and knowing how to please both sides, then the hate wouldn't have been this massive.

    So in other words, the issue is not the existence of Marie Rose and Honoka, it's how the marketing was done awfully. Which is also one of the main reasons why DOA is pretty much dead at this point and the only thing relevant is Xtreme Venus.

  31. Dude, Marie Rose and Honoka are hated because Koei Tecmo keep shove them down our throats, even putting them where they don't belong, like a Dynasty Warriors-like game. I get it that you said that we wouldn't play these fully fanservice games where they appeared in, but did you even take a look at the current state of Dead Or Alive and the way Koei Tecmo has been treating it? They have completely ignored a big portion of the fanbase and just use Marie Rose and Honoka as their "tickets" for easy and cheap money for the current japanese "fanbase" which is just a bunch of otakus who probably didn't even grow up with the series. Why else is the current focus of DOA just on the japanese-exclusive game like Xtreme Venus where they barely even have the OG ladies and it's mostly dominated by a buch of short little girls who even have the same face and body proportions of Marie and Honoka? Because Koei Tecmo has decided to completely neglect the fighting scene altogether of Dead Or Alive and now just using the Xtreme series for easy money. It's clear that they don't have any faith in the franchise and now they only rely on the Japanese otakus. It's not that hard to understand why Marie Rose and Honoka would get so much hate. They are the reason why DOA is doomed as a franchise and it will only take a miracle for it to come back properly.

  32. I'm mostly indifferent to the hate any fighting game character gets! 🥱

  33. That cancelled Capcom Fighting All Stars sure did sound interesting and would probably have been fun.

  34. Why? Because boys want every playable character to be a boy. Duh.

    The outcry is surprisingly based on emotion from the gender that wants to be about logic and reason.

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